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Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Do 20. Feb 2014, 04:56
von Krazyguy75
My problem with the ending is the lack of demonstrated character development.

If Rufus' were to die, his death should have lasting ripples throughout all of Deponia, all of Elysium, and all the people he met.

We get to see Rufus' supposed death, and we see goal and Cletus go to Elysium. But even that lacks development.

I'm fine with Rufus' fate being left unknown. I'm fine with him never making it to Elysium.

However, here's what my ending would've added:

When asked to impersonate Rufus', Cletus should have argued, and then Goal should have said something along the lines of "Do it for Rufus", whereupon Cletus' expression should soften, look at goal, and say, "Fine, I'll do it. It'll be my last favor to him."

A scene should exist where Toni hears of Rufus' death, picks his coat off the ground, and cries, while Rufus' other friends gather around her and try to comfort her.

Cletus, as "Rufus" should give a rallying speech on the improvement of the planet, and turning the planet habitable again. He should convince the Organon the help rebuild the world from the trash it has become.

Hermes should look up at Elysium, framed by sunset, and smile at the sight of the ships coming down to help rebuild the planet. Then he should look at the cloning facility and walk away, blast doors sealing it off behind him, with a line akin to "The world doesn't need more heroes. Thank you, Rufus'. Thank you for providing us with hope."

At the very end, when Goal looks towards the horizon sadly, Cletus should walk up next to her, and put his arm around her, comfortingly, but not in a way indicative of a lover, as the look into the distance.

This would be character development for Cletus, who shows that he can care for others, that he is willing to repay his debts, and that he is willing to work together with others to build a better future. It would further develop Toni, as even though Rufus annoyed her to no end, she was still his ex-girlfriend, and I doubt she really wished for Rufus' to die. It would show that Hermes regained his hope, and would show that Rufus' is no longer needed. It would even help add personality to every character in the game, showing that Rufus' impact helped unite cultures, and that the Organons can do good deeds, and that even the people of Deponia who had previously hated him can see that he was a good person, and a hero, in the end.

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Do 20. Feb 2014, 17:30
von FreeBird
But Cletus didn't develope. He only is alive because he was selfish enough to accept rufus sacrifice. Goal on the other hand actualy shows developement: She is not the innocent person she was anymore, she knows that Cletus hated Rufus because how similar yet different he was to him. Forcing someone into impersonating his "nemesis" is something she wouldn't normaly do, however she is angry about her mistake and punishes Cletus for his dishonesty. The character developement is not obvious, but it certainly is there.

The other characters you mention are either (lovable, but nevertheless) side characters who aren't realy required to have a strong developement throughout the game, or, in the case of Hermes, dead.

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Do 10. Apr 2014, 16:47
von Tosh
What a bunch of moaners! xDDD

I just finished all 3 games and.. what's wrong with you people!?))) Rufus proved that he can solve any situation, no matter how hopeless it is! He survived his natural self-destructive nature, moaning comerades, hopeless battles, died several times, returned from hell, saved Goal and the whole Deponia, and Elysium!!! +))

He will definitely come up with an extremely impossible plan to break from developers heads to our screens! >__<

I NEED YOU TO BELIEVE IN RUFUS!!!
Bild

On the other hand, we... THE PLAYERS... as always have to help Rufus in his epic quest! Our faith, mind, mice and sense of humor are to guide him on his way to Goal and the future! Even if we can't see or hear him, we all know that he's still out there! Wandering on the other side of reality, searching for the tutorial press!

I was waiting for a game like Deponia for ages! And I won't let everything end like that!!!

People! We need to come up with a Rufus-style plan to rescue him from the heads of developers... maybe we should begin with firing up something!? And we definitely need a bolt cutter!!! xDDD

Anyway! Listen to me DAEDALIC! You said there will be no sequels?!

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!
Bild

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: So 13. Apr 2014, 20:00
von Patamen
No Sequels, yes? How about Trilogy/Game with name "Elisium". It's so good way to make other game about Rufus, Goal and he's adventures in Daedalic hands :D
And hey, stop. If 1 of 3 person will fall other will be killed by rotation, but Rufus fell and Goal took Cletus. This means that Goal could save 2 of 3

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: So 13. Apr 2014, 20:21
von Tosh
I'm actually about to start a resistance to DAEDALIC. :twisted:

When i'll finish the website, i'll post a link here)) We'll coordinate our attacks from there :ugeek:

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Mi 16. Apr 2014, 15:54
von Soul
Tosh hat geschrieben:I'm actually about to start a resistance to DAEDALIC. :twisted:

When i'll finish the website, i'll post a link here)) We'll coordinate our attacks from there :ugeek:


Fuck yea man. Count me in when you start the rebellion :twisted:

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Mi 21. Mai 2014, 06:16
von Notoremo
Krazyguy75 hat geschrieben:My problem with the ending is the lack of demonstrated character development.

If Rufus' were to die, his death should have lasting ripples throughout all of Deponia, all of Elysium, and all the people he met.

We get to see Rufus' supposed death, and we see goal and Cletus go to Elysium. But even that lacks development.

I'm fine with Rufus' fate being left unknown. I'm fine with him never making it to Elysium.

However, here's what my ending would've added:

When asked to impersonate Rufus', Cletus should have argued, and then Goal should have said something along the lines of "Do it for Rufus", whereupon Cletus' expression should soften, look at goal, and say, "Fine, I'll do it. It'll be my last favor to him."

A scene should exist where Toni hears of Rufus' death, picks his coat off the ground, and cries, while Rufus' other friends gather around her and try to comfort her.

Cletus, as "Rufus" should give a rallying speech on the improvement of the planet, and turning the planet habitable again. He should convince the Organon the help rebuild the world from the trash it has become.

Hermes should look up at Elysium, framed by sunset, and smile at the sight of the ships coming down to help rebuild the planet. Then he should look at the cloning facility and walk away, blast doors sealing it off behind him, with a line akin to "The world doesn't need more heroes. Thank you, Rufus'. Thank you for providing us with hope."

At the very end, when Goal looks towards the horizon sadly, Cletus should walk up next to her, and put his arm around her, comfortingly, but not in a way indicative of a lover, as the look into the distance.

This would be character development for Cletus, who shows that he can care for others, that he is willing to repay his debts, and that he is willing to work together with others to build a better future. It would further develop Toni, as even though Rufus annoyed her to no end, she was still his ex-girlfriend, and I doubt she really wished for Rufus' to die. It would show that Hermes regained his hope, and would show that Rufus' is no longer needed. It would even help add personality to every character in the game, showing that Rufus' impact helped unite cultures, and that the Organons can do good deeds, and that even the people of Deponia who had previously hated him can see that he was a good person, and a hero, in the end.


I'm so glad that somebody else mentions this! My biggest issue is not only with the ending itself (which was, quite simply, awful), but the lack of any development, or even closure with any of the characters. I loved the characters to death in the series, and I felt each had a wonderfully bizarre personality that had me genuinely intrigued. But, as the game drew to a close, I came upon the realization that through the whole series, each character was entirely static with no depth whatsoever. Goal is split into three personalities in the second game, and either a baby or gone in the third, so you can hardly get to know her. Rufus is the same old jerk doofus he was from the start, learning absolutely nothing throughout all his experiences (and, in fact, sometimes getting worse). All the characters are like this, being not dynamic, but, again, static. Surprisingly, even Bozo appeared more complex than Rufus.

That is, until the very end, in which Rufus has a spontaneous change of heart and decides to die for Deponia. Why now? Why so sudden? I don't know, the ending was awful. Not only did it give no closure whatsoever, but it ended the series with an extremely high amount of loose threads that simply beg answers.

But, the games were great besides that. I loved the gameplay, I adored the animation and style, and, despite the nonexistent depth within the characters, I thoroughly enjoyed them and the story. They were all extremely likable, even with their lack of depth. I just feel so bad when a series gets so close to being even better, with endless potential, but doesn't succeed at doing so even though I so desperately wish it could. But, those are just my two-cents on the ending and the series as a whole.

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Mi 30. Jul 2014, 20:13
von Haravikk
I just finished the entire trilogy today and the ending is very bittersweet; after the entire game was full of humour and general optimism I'm not sure that it suited such a drastic reversal.

Don't get me wrong, I think that having Rufus ultimately make sacrifices to save Deponia, Elysium and Goal was a good way to end the trilogy, but the ending just seemed to introduce more questions rather than answering any of them.

For example, I initially chose to interpret the ending with Rufus sacrificing himself because he knows that Argus won't give up, and must be stopped at all costs (i.e - even saving Cletus is a better option as at least then Deponia and Goal will be safe), and that in doing so he fell down onto the walk-way below, while Argus is the one seen falling to his death (explaining the way the laugh sounds). However, this still leaves Rufus trapped below the rotor without time to escape to Elysium. He could then presumably meet up with any of the Deponians (Bozo, Toni etc.) left aboard the high ship, since they would want to return home anyway, crash-landing with them back on the surface. After all the high ship was huge, so it could probably survive the fall, albeit ruined, with the engines still partly functional.

While Rufus surviving in this way might explain how Cletus got his clothes (passed up to him somehow), trying to justify why Cletus was dressing as Rufus gets a bit flimsy. For example, you could interpret it such that what Elysium needs now is Rufus, not Cletus, and being clones Cletus should possess the same capacity for creativity; the disguise could then be explained if Cletus is held in poor regard by the council (or considered uncreative), so pretending to be someone else is the only way to get his ideas across. It just about works, but it seems a bit of a stretch, especially when nothing is hinted at strongly enough.

I guess the main problem is that the ending just isn't properly conclusive; you just can't have such a twist ending, imply that the main character died (again) then leave it at that, especially with the falling "Rufus" laughing like Argus or Cletus. I'd have much rather have had an end scene showing Rufus with his friends on Deponia, maybe with Toni begrudgingly respecting his sacrifice even as he embarks on more mad schemes to reach Elysium even though it's now more hopeless than ever; after all the thing that sets Rufus apart is his incredible capacity for hope even in the worst situations, so while it would have still been a somewhat unhappy ending with Goal and Rufus forced apart, at least it would have the note of hope in keeping with the rest of the series.


Anyway, this all aside, I'd still like to see some games set on Elysium with Goal as the main character, helped by Cletus as he tries to live up to Rufus' example. After all, we actually didn't see all that much of Goal during the series, as she spent most of the first game unconscious, most of the second in three different pieces, and most of the third undergoing surgery or as a child. My main disappointment was also the lack of any playable scenes on Elysium, so a couple of games dealing with that would be good; if my chosen interpretation of how Rufus survived were to then be confirmed there could even be a chance for a happy ending if Elysium lands back on Deponia, allowing the pair to be reunited.

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Sa 16. Aug 2014, 02:10
von Mr_Nabby
One thing that I have been completely unable to find any information about is about Rufus' adoptive mother. Her existence is just barely mentioned, but in the third game, it is implied in Rufus' confrontation with Captain Seagull that it is Rufus' fault that she died. What?

Every mention of her character I could find is this:
Chaos on Depinia
(From The date with Lady Goal)
Seagull: I'm not Rufus' father. I took him in when I was still Mayor of Kuvaq. We(?) found him in the garbage, kicking and screaming.

Goodbye Deponia
(During the confrontation with Seagull, Rufus[A] passes blame to Rufus[B])
Rufus[A]: And, yes, it's his fault that...
Seagull: THAT'S ENOUGH!!!
Rufus[A] ...Mom died.
Seagull frustratedly shoots Rufus[B]

The only other place that it is mentioned is on Rufus' wiki-page, under 'trivia'.
http://deponia-trilogy.wikia.com/wiki/Rufus

Has anyone else given this any thought? Does anyone know anything about this mostly glossed over fact? Is it anything that could(or should) be expanded upon in a potential sequel?

Re: Deponia 4?

Verfasst: Sa 7. Feb 2015, 18:44
von PLyczkowski
Krazyguy75 hat geschrieben:My problem with the ending is the lack of demonstrated character development.

If Rufus' were to die, his death should have lasting ripples throughout all of Deponia, all of Elysium, and all the people he met.

We get to see Rufus' supposed death, and we see goal and Cletus go to Elysium. But even that lacks development.

I'm fine with Rufus' fate being left unknown. I'm fine with him never making it to Elysium.

However, here's what my ending would've added:

When asked to impersonate Rufus', Cletus should have argued, and then Goal should have said something along the lines of "Do it for Rufus", whereupon Cletus' expression should soften, look at goal, and say, "Fine, I'll do it. It'll be my last favor to him."

A scene should exist where Toni hears of Rufus' death, picks his coat off the ground, and cries, while Rufus' other friends gather around her and try to comfort her.

Cletus, as "Rufus" should give a rallying speech on the improvement of the planet, and turning the planet habitable again. He should convince the Organon the help rebuild the world from the trash it has become.

Hermes should look up at Elysium, framed by sunset, and smile at the sight of the ships coming down to help rebuild the planet. Then he should look at the cloning facility and walk away, blast doors sealing it off behind him, with a line akin to "The world doesn't need more heroes. Thank you, Rufus'. Thank you for providing us with hope."

At the very end, when Goal looks towards the horizon sadly, Cletus should walk up next to her, and put his arm around her, comfortingly, but not in a way indicative of a lover, as the look into the distance.

This would be character development for Cletus, who shows that he can care for others, that he is willing to repay his debts, and that he is willing to work together with others to build a better future. It would further develop Toni, as even though Rufus annoyed her to no end, she was still his ex-girlfriend, and I doubt she really wished for Rufus' to die. It would show that Hermes regained his hope, and would show that Rufus' is no longer needed. It would even help add personality to every character in the game, showing that Rufus' impact helped unite cultures, and that the Organons can do good deeds, and that even the people of Deponia who had previously hated him can see that he was a good person, and a hero, in the end.


This.

The idea for a martyr ending wasn't bad - it was just very badly executed.

The feeling the player gets isn't that the protagonist sacrificed himself. The feeling is that he, due to some weird machination, the whole deal with the rotor, badly conducted last conversation or just pure chance, he died before reaching his objective.

IF the ending was conducted in a way that we could see his sacrifice - for instance if the whole gang was gathered on the bridge, no one would want to go disable the transmitter, and Rufus would volunteer, and then they would watch his last heroic deeds where despite the danger and pain (maybe ho would become more and more wounded trying to reach the transmitter), and in the end he died, to the horror and despair of all his "friends", allowing them to live a better life remembering him and reevaluating him (which would be shown) - the feeling would be that the whole journey had sense.